Auto Reset Breakers

[RognMar]

Greetings,
I am hoping someone can identify what size fuses these are, and what they are protecting.
The reason I am asking my 12vdc system is not working right now, kinda. The last time I used my Avenue 32rls was on the way back from the Rally (which was Freaking Awesome) at a Pennsylvania State park then to home/storage Our 12vdc was working because we had to turn off our 12v refigerator. At that time everything on 12v-was working, lights, slides, fans, ...
I own a Renogy 3000w inverter that is wired to the 5 invertable receptacles in my RV. They did not work on the way to the Rally (which was Freaking Awesome). Both AC and DC systems worked when I am connected to 50a shore power. The following Saturday went to work on the Inverter. I had spoke to Renogy and they suggested a "Hard Reset" which worked. I opened the front Bay, turned the disconnect to the Off position, glanced at the Solar controler an noticed 14.4v in the display. Turned off the solar breakers, and measured DC voltage on the Inverters 12v input. Got 0vdc. Did the Hard Reset, then compleated the rewiring my 4/0 to the input of inverter, turned on the solar, again 14.3v, however the inverter DC inputs where about 12vdc. Ran out of time for the day.
The following Saturday// same thing no 12v system. This time I had my Truck. Plugged in to the 7 pin connector, all 12vDC devices work fine, disconnect from my truck, no 12vDC system. The Inverter works.
Thanks for your thoughts.
Roger

 

[Jim Beletti]

It almost sounds like your RV battery isn't connected to the DC system? As in, perhaps a disconnect switch of battery fuse is blown?

In your second picture is a vertical row of DC mini-breakers. These breakers protect high-current DC items like awnings, hydraulics and more. None of them will be a battery fuse though.
I hear you saying that you are getting good solar DC voltage and good truck DC voltage. It still sounds like the power to/from the battery is disconnected/turned off.

 

[RognMar]

Jim, It was a long post. I did check for DC voltage changes on the load side of the battery disconnect. With solar breakers pushed down or off and the disconnect on/arrow up, i do have DC volts, when I turn the battery disconnect counter Clockwise my battery voltage appears. I did not have enough time to do the next step.
Taking the cover off and check the DC input and outputs of the mini breakers that are located to the the right of the charge controler. Its almost like the copper bar connection that feeds most of the Mini breakers and the other connections came disconnected at the same time, i doubt it, its my next step. I will keep posting my discoveries. Unfortunately my Avenue is stored about an 45 minutes away from home. The place is is inexpensive, however in this case inconvenient. I was wondering if you could give me the ratings of the Black, Green, White, Blue, and Yellow mini breakers. Is there some type of decoder ring to figure out the colors to ratings? The Alliance part numbers would be helpful in case i want go that route. I want my next trip to count. Also is there a DC wiring diagram or schematic somewhere?
Thanks again
Roger

 

[RognMar]

Jim, it's like finding your keys, the last place you look, walla you suddenly remember what you did.
I was troubleshooting with my Renogy 3000w inverter not working few days before this started. Renogy told me to do a "Hard Reset". Unwire everything from the inverter, 12Vdc feeds, all 120Vac outputs and the Ground. Then wait between 30 minutes to an hour. I used the same self tapping screw with a pre installed Green wire to Ground my inverter. I thought at the time, Score, one less thing yo do i can use it to Ground the inverter. When I removed it for the "Hard Reset" I thought I saw something fly out.
I tucked the wires away and did the "Hard Reset " very successful test.
Back to DC world.
I did test on both sides of the Mini Breakers. Got 13Vdc on the input and outputs. Next stop Breaker/fuse Box, and did not have 12Vdc on either of the RED wires measured to the Black wires.
I called Alliance to ask if there was another fuse between the Breaker/ Fuse box and the front Bay. I was asked to send a email with my questions. Writing the email I thought let's take another look. This is the stupid simple thing, attached to the Break/Fuse box I have 2 RED and 1 Black SHINY wires. I went to the foward bay and found 2 of all the RED wires were SHINY. Could not find Black SHINY wire, I reached behind the frame and found the Black SHINY wire. Pulled it out and lined up with the hole (finding my keys moment). You can see that attachment point above my shuntand slightly to the right In one of my attachments. If I zoom it I swear I see something. It might be withful thinking.
I got my wire brush attatchmet for my drill and removed some paint and reattached the wire to the frame. DC works.
I have been having intermittent DC system failures, hence what ever few out. Poor connection, grinding will solve that issue too.
Your original answer was 100% correct. "It almost sounds like your RV battery isn't connected to the DC system",
I hope this post helps some else "Find there Keys".
Thank you
SHINY WIRES Roger

 

[Jim Beletti]

Hi Roger,

Sorry but I don't know the breaker values. Your best bet is to email Alliance Customer Service for that at service@alliancerv.com.

Happy to hear you're making progress on your system.

 

[AL Storey]

Hello, I have a 2023 Alliance Paradigm 370fb.
We keep losing our 12V intermittently but the 110 side stays on since the batteries kick in. The 12V side will come back on when I disconnect from our shore power and plug in again.
Seems like there must be a self-resetting breaker somewhere? Just wanted to confirm my rig has that type of breaker. Also need help locating where this might be on my 370FB.
I appreciate any responses, as having to unplug and plug in again, cycle on and off is happening too often. Thanks

 

[BryanValRox]

Hello, I have a 2023 Alliance Paradigm 370fb.
We keep losing our 12V intermittently but the 110 side stays on since the batteries kick in. The 12V side will come back on when I disconnect from our shore power and plug in again.
Seems like there must be a self-resetting breaker somewhere? Just wanted to confirm my rig has that type of breaker. Also need help locating where this might be on my 370FB.
I appreciate any responses, as having to unplug and plug in again, cycle on and off is happening too often. Thanks

Hi folks, sorry your having issues.
More details will be necessary. Is your system a standard install from the factory? Do you have standard Solar or Super Solar package?

The 12 volt DC side and 120 AC side are isolated from one another, so I am confused by your comment about the 110 stays on since the batteries kick in.

What do you loose on the 12 volt side? Specific components or everything?

Without some specific details or even pictures of your system , the only thing that I could suggest at this point would be to check your battery, battery connections, converter output etc.

You converter is designed to accommodate some 12 v DC loads and keep your battery charged up for the higher load devices.

Glad to try and help more with additional details.

 

[AL Storey]

Hi,

We have the standard install from the factory .
We have the standard solar package.
We loose the microwave, AC, fireplace heater and the outlets to the TV, recliners bathrooms, etc.

I had a tech out a couple days ago,.batteries checked out good and fully charged.
He said our convertor does exactly what you mentioned. Of course our power was staying on while he was here.

Here are some pictures. Let me know what else you might need.

Really appreciate your quick response!
Thanks

 

[BryanValRox]

Hi,

We have the standard install from the factory .
We have the standard solar package.
We loose the microwave, AC, fireplace heater and the outlets to the TV, recliners bathrooms, etc.

I had a tech out a couple days ago,.batteries checked out good and fully charged.
He said our convertor does exactly what you mentioned. Of course our power was staying on while he was here.

Here are some pictures. Let me know what else you might need.

Really appreciate your quick response!
Thanks

Ok, if you are loosing the items listed above, you are loosing the 120v AC side not the 12 VDC side as you previously indicated.

My take is this, if your not experiencing tripped breakers on your main panel, and are comfortable working with AC voltage, I would suggest that you investigate your power pedestal, 50 amp cord/ connections and or any surge protector you have in-line for a possible issue.

Do you happen to have a genset? I see a box referencing a Genset connection. If so, I would locate the transfer switch and check the connections for tightness.

Also, you might need to check the connections from your coach shore power connection to your main breaker panel for secue connections.

Also, as a separate issue, I believe you need to investigate your solar system set up and operation. Your display values don’t look correct to me.

 

[AL Storey]

Ok, if you are loosing the items listed above, you are loosing the 120v AC side not the 12 VDC side as you previously indicated.

My take is this, if your not experiencing tripped breakers on your main panel, and are comfortable working with AC voltage, I would suggest that you investigate your power pedestal, 50 amp cord/ connections and or any surge protector you have in-line for a possible issue.

Do you happen to have a genset? I see a box referencing a Genset connection. If so, I would locate the transfer switch and check the connections for tightness.

Also, you might need to check the connections from your coach shore power connection to your main breaker panel for secue connections.

Also, as a separate issue, I believe you need to investigate your solar system set up and operation. Your display values don’t look correct to me.

Hi Bryan,

Thanks for the correction on the power, I was trying to remember what the te h said a few days ago.

I have had the pedestal checked out before and had Edison stop by and he determined it was working correctly. I have removed the surge protector for a while. We still lost power intermittently plugging in directly.

We do not have genset, it's just wired for one.
What do you see on the solar system? What should the display say?

 

[BryanValRox]

Hi Bryan,

Thanks for the correction on the power, I was trying to remember what the te h said a few days ago.

I have had the pedestal checked out before and had Edison stop by and he determined it was working correctly. I have removed the surge protector for a while. We still lost power intermittently plugging in directly.

We do not have genset, it's just wired for one.
What do you see on the solar system? What should the display say?

AL,
Even though you don’t have a genset, you have genset prep. this means that you still have a transfer switch installed behind one of your basement panels. Follow the heavy wire coming out of the silver junction box in you picture.
Your shore power will still travel thru the transfer switch, so I would highly recommend your track that down and check all of your connections.
If you hear a heavy klunk when the power drops out that would be a sure sign that the transfer switch is involved in your issue in some way. Maybe not root cause, but it is a clue.

Regarding your Solar, it is not related to your current issue, but the current screen isn’t showing much information.
You should try to get to a default screen or charge screen, and you should see battery type, voltage, charge output, panel output etc etc .
Attached is a manual that should help you double check programming and operation.

 

[AL Storey]

Thanks Bryan,

That's good to know. I'll have to track the switch down and check all connections another day as we are now having heavy rain today.
Appreciate the manual!
Once I have info, I'll get back to you.

Thanks again, AL

 

[jagibson58]

Alliance breakers pricing:

 

[AL Storey]

Hi Bryan,

We finally we have some clear weather and I had a technician come out today. We found the intermittent power losses was due to fact our transfer switch was not completely installed correctly. Basically, none of the wires into the box or inside the box were tightened down, they were just set in place loose and not screwed in place. The ground was just loose and barely touching the lug. You can see in the pictures we have a fried wire which could have easily started a fire previously or in the near future.
I'll have a new switch coming to be installed correctly soon.
I will also be installing a smoke/gas detector in the pass through for safety.
Crazy that Alliance would release a RV with loose wires which could be easily seen just looking at the box before taking the lid off.
Again, greatly appreciated you helping me.
All the best, AL

 

[BryanValRox]

Hi Bryan,

We finally we have some clear weather and I had a technician come out today. We found the intermittent power losses was due to fact our transfer switch was not completely installed correctly. Basically, none of the wires into the box or inside the box were tightened down, they were just set in place loose and not screwed in place. The ground was just loose and barely touching the lug. You can see in the pictures we have a fried wire which could have easily started a fire previously or in the near future.
I'll have a new switch coming to be installed correctly soon.
I will also be installing a smoke/gas detector in the pass through for safety.
Crazy that Alliance would release a RV with loose wires which could be easily seen just looking at the box before taking the lid off.
Again, greatly appreciated you helping me.
All the best, AL

Al, thanks for the follow up and photos. I am glad you and your family are safe and I was able to help you locate your issue.

You are correct, that was a disaster just waiting to happen.

Happy to hear you have new parts on the way and safety measures to be installed.

The “WHY” may not be Alliance fault. I am not defending them, I am just saying that it is possible that someone else might have touched the switch at some point in its life. It is also possible that thermal expansion and contraction has causes the screws to become loose. Also, travel miles, rough road etc might have contributed at some point.
OR to your point it could be just plain old shoddy workmanship.

My take is that if was like that from new, problems would have surfaced pretty much immediately.

Please ensure your tech applies the proper torque values to those connection(They should be listed) and will be different based on terminal size.

Additionally while you have him, I would suggest that you have him ensure that shore power wall connection socket terminals are tight as well as pulling your breaker panel out to ensure those connections are tight as well. Basically, if he see’s a connection have him check it for tightness.

I spend some time each season, going over our electrical connections ensuring that they are all snug as part of yearly maintenance. I do both systems 120AC and 12 V DC.

Again, I am glad you found it and everyone is safe!

 

[AL Storey]

Hi Bryan,
We've had our 370FB for 2yrs now. It only traveled out to CA and then another hour to our full time location is the story I was told by the sales guy. Hopefully that is true? It's always posible somebody along the way could have fiddled with the transfer switch. Just odd that all the wires were loose, almost like someone was putting it together, took a break then forgot to come back and finish the job.
The issue did happen early on, but when I'd unplug and plug in again we could be good for months.
Thanks for the tip on checking all connections, we're full time in a permanent location but will take the extra steps as recommended.

We love our Alliance Paradigm and have had some minor issues which the excellent customer service staff at Alliance helped us with or our local technicians in the area. Overall, we always recommend Alliance to our friends.
We all good now and again greatly appreciate your help.
Thanks, AL

 

[BryanValRox]

Hi Bryan,
We've had our 370FB for 2yrs now. It only traveled out to CA and then another hour to our full time location is the story I was told by the sales guy. Hopefully that is true? It's always posible somebody along the way could have fiddled with the transfer switch. Just odd that all the wires were loose, almost like someone was putting it together, took a break then forgot to come back and finish the job.
The issue did happen early on, but when I'd unplug and plug in again we could be good for months.
Thanks for the tip on checking all connections, we're full time in a permanent location but will take the extra steps as recommended.

We love our Alliance Paradigm and have had some minor issues which the excellent customer service staff at Alliance helped us with or our local technicians in the area. Overall, we always recommend Alliance to our friends.
We all good now and again greatly appreciate your help.
Thanks, AL

Al,
I forgot to ask how your Solar Controller Investigation is going.

After another look at your pictpure, the display is showing the LOAD Screen. I see you have no wires hooked up to those terminals, so you could ensure that you turn that off in the programming and use the arrows to get you to a more informative screen. Ideally in my opinion, you would want to see the screen that shows you the most info on one screen.
There is a screen that would display System Battery Voltage, Battery Type, Solar Charger Rate/mode, and icons that would indicate day or night(sun/moon) that represent if the panels are inputting to the controller.
I understand your stationary and always hook to a pedestal, so your solar might not factor in, but it would be best to ensure the proper setting to maximize your battery / equipment life.

 

[jagibson58]

Alliance breakers types and pricing attachment: